How to Argue in Japanese

| Japan | 70 Comments |

In a recent scuffle over the controversial whaling issue, I managed to seriously offend a couple of Japanese friends. Political and ethical issues are volatile topics, but add to that cultural differences when arguing and you have a recipe for disaster. So here’s some insight to help you avoid making the same mistakes.

See the end of this post for a light-hearted video collaboration illustrating the points I explain here!

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My friend Hikosaemon is a learned, friendly guy who has been living in Japan for around 10 years or so and pursuing the Japanese language and culture for much longer. He’s often remarked how my views remind him of himself at my age and he offers great insight into often misunderstood aspects of Japanese culture. He’s also quite a dab hand at the old debate, clearly and eloquently making points while acknowledging the position of the other person.

So for two pretty relaxed Westerners like us, frank discussion is quite a normal thing. Subtle humour flows, opposing viewpoints are exchanged and logical debate prevails. And I use ‘Westerner’ in a very loose sense – he is originally from New Zealand and me from the U.K. As close as our cultures are on the surface, they are still somewhat different underneath. But arguably not quite as different as when compared to East Asian countries, especially Japan.

I fear I will only be able to touch the tip of the iceberg in this post and risk running aground of the notorious problem of lumping countries into general categories – namely ‘East’ and ‘West’ – but please bear with me. This isn’t a studious, academic essay, but rather based on the observations and experiences of Hikosaemon and myself (and much more from the former!)

Guided Questioning


Let’s begin by thinking about a style of speech, in particular the dialectic method present in both Eastern and Western philosophy. The old Greek philosopher Socrates was famous for using this method and took to the streets of Athens with his unique form of persistent guided questioning. The method is a way to illuminate ideas and expose the cracks in the other person’s arguments, thus strengthening one’s own position.

Here’s a good example of classic Socrates in Eurythphro.

It’s widely regarded that this style of questioning – the Socratic Method – is one of the best ways to help people to learn the skill of critical thinking. Alas, used the wrong way it has the tendency to completely piss the other person off, especially when they aren’t familiar with the technique or are good at using it themselves.

Debating with Japanese People


Now this dialectic style of conversation is not unique to the West, although it does seem to me to be somewhat more ingrained. Or perhaps it would be better of me to say that the confrontational approach it inevitably brings with it is more tolerated in the West. One can go forth and express views, ask questions and raise counterpoints quite frankly. Of course, not everyone will be quite the placid philosopher when having a discussion, but in my experience most people can keep a level head even when faced with viewpoints directly opposed to their own. In short, there is less of a need to show empathy for the other person’s views and try to keep the discussion harmonious when arguing with a Westerner.

With Japanese people however, there is a perceived need to recognise and comment on the validity of the other person’s views almost as readily as expressing one’s own views. It’s simply not acceptable to listen to your opponent, consider their argument and then fire back a question exposing a weakness or let loose with a contradictory counterpoint. No. The moment the other person feels like you are dismissing their opinions, the conversation is pretty much over. This is the big lesson that I learned recently, despite having been warned in advance by Hikosaemon to be careful when having debates on controversial topics with Japanese people. I slipped right into the trap, went into debate mode and fired piercing questions that exposed logical inconsistencies in the other person’s views. Basically, I was an asshole.

Hikosaemon notes that constantly reinforcing your own viewpoint is seen as self-centred (自己中心) in Japan. For me, explaining my argument with absolute clarity has always been the utmost important thing to do. It has been drilled into me over 6 years of Philosophy education. Lack of clarity almost always makes for bad arguments. But in Japan, showing understanding and a sense of affirmation about the other side’s views is more important. What may seem like a painfully lacking argument to you is still the opinion of your opponent, and no matter how wrong you think they are (or how wrong they may actually be factually), there is a necessity to recognise the possibility that they may be correct. To not do so is akin to slapping the other person in the face.

Now you might wonder, as I did, what you can do when you reach an impasse. What if the other side states their argument, you state yours and both sides show understanding and appreciation for each other’s opinions. How then to dissolve the deadlock in the views? The answer, it seems, is that you cannot, at least not easily.

Hikosaemon again lends his expert advice. In Japan, once this sort of deadlock is reached, the nemawashi begins (根回し). Both sides look for a hint of common ground to begin upon and take it slowly, building up as far as possible. If after that no further progress can be made, both sides (if they are of typical Japanese thinking) will seek to compromise their own position in order to meet the opponent halfway out of politeness. This politeness was gained in the previous session when showing appreciation for one another’s views. The mutual pursuit of harmony, in other words.

Even so, this method tends to be short on results. Implacably opposed views come to a standstill when both sides avoid the confrontation as long as possible until the situation changes in a way that they can agree on it or they are forced to clash.

Controversial Topics are Not for Everyone


Another important consideration is that not everyone is ready for or even wants a debate. They may spout off controversial opinions blissfully or be so self-assured of their position that they honestly do not expect to be criticised for it. But this is the internet, and that great cloak of anonymity emboldens even the meekest of us. Those who wouldn’t dare to even bat an eyelid in ‘real life’ discussion let loose on platforms such as Twitter, Blogs or Forums. 2chan, that infamous collection of message boards only for people in Japan holds this as a golden rule. Everyone is anonymous.

A recent University graduate myself, I was quite rightly put in place when Hikosaemon explained to me that coming out of the grand oak doors of higher education armed with 4 years knowledge is like stepping out with boxing gloves on. You feel empowered, eager to try out all those years of book-learning on someone. You’re looking for a fight, in a way. Most people don’t wander around wearing boxing gloves and certainly aren’t always ready for a duel of the mind. There’s gardening to be done, taxes to pay and life to live. A prod or two with one’s boxing gloves is enough to irritate and alienate people who do not wish to have a discussion.

I’m quite likely guilty of making this mistake, even though I’ve always been naturally prone to devil’s advocate style antagonistic questioning even before entering University. Thus, the message here is to make doubly sure that your opponent is kitted up and wearing their gloves before you take a swing. Some people are naturally always ready, but many aren’t and you may even find yourself losing friends or co-workers through an offhanded political comment or ethical quip.

Be very, very careful when bringing up these sorts of controversial topics with Japanese people, especially if you are not quite sure about how to manoeuvre the conversation skilfully enough to avoid treading on the other person’s toes. It’s all too easy to think you are having a pleasant, intellectual discussion only for it to suddenly turn bad and leave deep-rooted grudges.

The Video


So below is the collaboration video Hikosaemon and I made with the help of a couple of other J-vloggers ElevenColors, Hanafubuki and GimmeaBoneDog.

Skit 1 shows two Westerners having an argument. Both really get stuck in and express their opinions, but neither is deeply offended by the other’s (crazy) views.

Skit 2 show a Japanese person and a Western person having an argument. The Westerner clearly refutes the Japanese person’s views and the conversation falls apart, most likely with the Japanese person never wanting to speak to the Western person again.

Skit 3 shows what a typical argument between two Japanese people would look like. Both show a painful level of consideration and appreciation of the other person’s views and basically end up not getting anywhere at all, still believing the same thing they started even though they verbally show warming to each other’s position.

I hope they illustrate the things I’ve been talking about in this post! Please do let me know if you have had any experiences like this yourself :).

Take care and happy (peaceful) debating!

(P.S. This post is also an entry into this month’s Japansoc Blog Matsuri hosted over at NihongoUp!)

  • somnyad

    It takes at least nine months to realize that the smiles on the clerk's face is not genuine, another three years to realize that you know nothing at all, and another year to realize that you actually have very, very few friends. At least, that was the situation for me. Most women don't last more than one year. The social pressure is amazing, and the inability to make real friends is oppressing. In my company, out of 100 permantent residents, 95 are men and 5 are women. I think this has more to do with women not being able to deal with the cold…

    • Fabrizio

      I TOTALLY agree with you.
      I’ve been living in Tokyo for almost 5 years now and it’s getting frustrating as hell.
      To be honest, I got fed up with it.
      Besides the fact that it’s really hard to bond with almost anyone here (and I speak japanese very well), when you start debating with a japanese person…it’s like a waste of time.
      Some even gaze at you thinking “he’s not japanese…he’d never understand what I’m talking about but let’s smile to him anyway”.
      When I walk inside a shop (any kind of) I feel like there’s this “hateful” energy all around me.
      I don’t want to start talking about women because I’m sure we could go on forever.
      It’s funny when you say the simplest thing like “yesterday I ate sushi in Hiroo” and they’d go like “eeeeeeee hontoooo?! sugoooi!” while clapping their hands.
      Well I’m sure you know what I’m talking about.
      I believe there’s also a LOT of ignorance here. I have met people thinking that the sun was a planet and that New Zealand was in Italy (since I’m italian).
      Or phrases like “do you have street lights in Italy?”, “is english the main language in italy?” and so on.
      This is pure madness.
      I have loved this city but I believe that for us western people it’s too alienating and stressful.
      Where do you live in Jap?
      Follow my blog and you’ll have some nice laughs :)

      Cheers!

      Fabrizio – http://tokyofreakkk.blogspot.com/

  • http://www.ladylarajonesadventures.com Lady Lara Jones

    Highly insightful! I was going to comment on Socratic method but I see it has been discussed at great length below, so instead I will just say great work that and I wish more visitors to Japan could see some of your articles (and similar articles/videos) that have a lot of valuable insight on cultural exchange and interaction here in Japan.

  • Structure

    This is good information – things that I realized in my business is that when facts are involved it is a bit easier to avoid nemawashi and correct the person. Also, feigning stupidity or feigning a joke works very well also but you have to be well aware of your current standing with the person whom you are speaking with before you decide which method to use.

    When talking to a good friend you can usually directly call them out on something as long as you are both lighthearted about the subject at hand.

    On the contrary to this post, though, there are some seriously direct and blunt Japanese people in business but they are usually the more senior people at a company.

    As one of the posters below explained, Japanese meetings and projects can go awry due to nemawashi. More than that, the projects often go nowhere after a 2 hour meeting turns into a nemawashi complaint session. In these cases I sometimes wonder if it would be best to just leverage my English-speaking roots and illuminate the points that everyone is avoiding… but I have quite a few superiors above me and have not had the courage to try to interject in that way during a meeting.

    Also, if anyone knows how to get a point across when you know an answer but just cannot explain it due to lack of information then I would be happy to be enlightened. A lot of times someone will simply keep pressing with questions even if you've given them the correct answer already but cannot explain how you arrived at it and I have to drop the topic.

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  • anonymous

    There are two other rules to remember:

    1) As a gaijin you and your opinions are at best an object of initial curiosity … but after that you are wrong. Do not confuse this initial curiosity with real “like” or actual value of you and your opinions.

    2) All Japanese think the same about everything … even when they patently obviously do not … because they are told they do. Never challenge this assumption.

  • http://gakuranman.com Gakuranman

    Thanks or your comment. I'm not sure whether you are talking half in jest, but I'll assume you're being serious…

    1) Is a huge stereotype and not true. I'm sorry, but views like this are what increase the divide between cultures.

    2) Every Japanese person is an individual living within the broader community, much like any other society. Certain levels of social protocol are expected and it is true that, very generally, group consensus and harmony takes precedence over individual opinions here in Japan.

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  • http://twitter.com/mathieucombet Mathieu Combet

    Hi,

    I liked this article, and it reminds so much when I have been to Japan;).This video is funny and well done and clearly show us the different ways to argue. I think that if I always liked so much this country is because I guess in some way I feel more comfortable with the Japanese way better than the westerner. My experience in Japan is very limited compare to you of course(I went there “just” 4 time as a tourist which is so different than working there)), but don't you feel that in Japan the communication is more non verbal(with eye, way of moving,smiling…), very subtle, and that you can get what the other think or feel just by looking at his/her reaction without a world coming out of his/her mouth? (and then when you get it the emotion is even stronger than with words) .In western world we are probably more bla bla people, more direct and even sometimes with some acting performance:). Nevertheless at the end I wonder that if it's not after all easier to get what a Japanese person feel or think(and stronger) than a westerner, simply because there is less embellishment in the conversation that can kill the real meaning of something(yes we are good comedians:). Well I am not saying that one is better than an other,but at the end I believe that it's just a question of culture understanding, and once you get it, things are much easier. Moreover each of us react differently on a certain situation.

    But, I got an other question. With my past experiences I often had this feeling that I was making the effort to understand the Japanese culture and so to do my possible not to be in harmony with the people.I had some Japanese Gf, an well the feeling I had is that this was a one way effort. So 1/ I was unlucky, 2/ they were actually trying to understand my culture bit it was so subtle and hidden that I did not see it or feel it, or 3/I was simply a selfish ignorant bastard;)…I still ask myself this question today, as I am not sure to have the answer.Strangely even if I was frustrated sometimes, I never felt this attraction with any other culture… Related to your experience what is your feeling on that?(sorry if you think it's too personal, you can choose not to answer;)

    I have to apologize for writing so much bla bla,(and with i ma sure many English mistakes) but after all I am a westerner..!!:)

    Anyway I like your blog, it's very instructive on many different subjects.Keep going on

    またね

    Mathieu

  • http://scalesoflibra.wordpress.com/ elisabel

    The school I work at has an English Course, and Debate is actually part of its curriculum. I work at a low level school, which makes teaching debate that much more of a struggle.

    For one, most of the kids simply do not have logic. At all. It's just not there. To top if off, the textbook is entirely in English, and their English ability is low. The kids don't really understand the point of anything beyond the affirmative constructive speech. Last year we explained things over and over, in English and in Japanese, and couldn't get much out of the kids. (Though to be fair last year's ichinensei were an extraordinarily lazy bunch.) At the end of the year I told the JTE in charge of debate, “I think they should debate in Japanese first,” and was told that “It's very hard for us Japanese to express our opinions in Japanese. I can't do it even though I can do it in English.” I was pretty exasperated by this response because our kids' English isn't sufficient to say what they ate for lunch in a complete sentence, much less begin to express anyone's opinion; plus they write all their work in Japanese first anyway. I was honestly too flabbergasted to do anything other than say “oh.” Thankfully, the JTE seems to have had a change of heart; so far she's had the kids do at least very basic drills in Japanese to make sure they understand the point of each section of a debate.

    I think I've ticked some of the JTEs off because I do have a problem with being very direct and honest. I mean, all of the long conversations I've had with JTEs are in English, and they're usually leading the conversation, but since I tend to answer questions directly such chats are like traps for me. I need to learn how to put the brakes on my mouth! Luckily most of the JTEs at my school speak very good English, several studied abroad at least briefly, so when things have been shaky it never lasts more than a couple of days; I think they understand that I'm not trying to be a jerk.

    I'm also noticing more and more how English between people who aren't super close friends tends to be indirect. I say things very directly and it bothers people. I don't insult them, I just say the bare facts. For example, some JETs were complaining that they were never told something or other, and I said, “that information is actually in the General Information Handbook.” They looked at me like I was a jerk. Maybe if I had said, “Oh! I wasn't told that either, I had to go looking in the GIH to find out!” it would have been okay. Also, another commenter noted that men are more likely to use the Socratic Method, and I think it's spot on and would add that it rubs many people the wrong way when women speak that way. There's still a ton of double standards in Western society.

  • http://gakuranman.com Gakuranman

    Thanks for your detailed comment elisabel. Always nice to hear from people working in the field. Did your Japanese students show any improvement on their debate technique or in their logic once you switched over to Japanese?

    Good point about the social expectations on how to speak as well. I reckon you're right that men and women can get away saying certain things and speaking a certain way that would be unacceptable for the other sex.

  • http://scalesoflibra.wordpress.com/ elisabel

    Yes, I think they did, at least with the initial building of just the affirmative constructive speech. They realize more quickly that some of the things they write don't make sense. For example, one simple practice resolution was “it's better to travel abroad than domestically.” Several students wrote, “if we travel abroad, we can make many friends.” I said to them, “Can you not make friends in Japan?” That was enough to get them to realize that they need to think about what they write to create reasons that make sense. They were able to say, “Oh, we need to say, 'we can make friends from other countries,' otherwise it's weird.” It's a small step towards understanding debate, but one I'm glad they made.

    • http://twitter.com/dshype3 Derek Blais

      I teach at a junior high school in a small, wealthy village. The kids at this school get opportunities that other publicly educated kids in Japan cannot get. We have a debate event once a year where an outside teacher (debate specialist?) does a debate lesson which is followed by an actual debate (done by students). It seems that every year the students fail to come up with good, logical arguments. As Hiko said, it’s hard to think critically when the social forces of Japan have been discouraging such things to maintain harmony for 300 years.

      I forgot to mention, the debate is taught and done in Japanese.

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  • http://shinpaideshou.wordpress.com Paura

    As a professor once put it to me, the primary difference in arguing between two American people and to Japanese people is the Americans will say, “No, your argument is 100% wrong, here is why.” while the Japanese will say, “Well, your argument is 10% right, but let me tell you about this other 90% I have found to be true.” :)

  • Glen Pearce

    Did somebody say Japanese whaling issue? ^_^

    http://www.moonie.ca/glenap/goofy/news.htmlJust a funny thought I had back in 1997. ^_^

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