Absolutely nothing… and Love

Published 22nd Dec, 2003 | Journal | 18 Comments |

…is what I’ve done today. Okay, ignore the paradox, but yea, I got up at 12.30pm after staying up until 3.00am trying to configure my wireless ADSL line and get rid of some blasted popup/toolbar thing that had decided to embed itself in my browser. Lots of registry deletions removed most of it so it couln’t function anymore. So today I’ve just surfed around doing nothing productive and I’ve been downloading lots of AFI stuff, which is growing on me a lot more now.

Check out this site! It completely rocks ^_^

*Visual Thesaurus*

I have loads of schoolwork and revision to do, so I’ll have to start that properly tomorrow. And right now I feel like starting a discussion. Granted this is not a message board, and there are properly only 2 or 3 people who will reply, but I still want to anyway. I remember a similar post I made on a forum some time ago, but here, I’ll start it again; (cut for practical reasons):

*********************
Love

I advise you to read these two pages before reading my own thoughts/questions:

Page #1
Page #2

Those of you who know me will immediately recognise that these are the very basic guidelines I usually ramble on about when a subject on relationships arises, mainly because these were the sources I found that made me re-think my take on relationships ^_^;.

With that new knowledge in mind, what are you thinking? This idea of conditional love for someone seems perfectly understandable; we experience it all the time within our lives – in movies, books and people. Everywhere, the idea that, if the person held in confidence makes a mistake, we love them less. I’m not suggesting for a moment that this is the only view, but it seems to be more prevalent than it’s opposing view of unconditional love. An example of unconditional love might be that of a parent towards the child. One would hope that the parent would always ‘love’ the child even if the child did make a mistake or get into trouble (etc).

But to what extent is this idea of unconditional love applicable? I agree with the point about choosing to love someone, as in, accepting him or her with open eyes, their ‘faults’ – and the stuff you don’t like so much about them – included. I think ‘falling in love’ in the traditional sense can be generally categorised as infatuation or ‘a crush’. We see someone we are physically attracted to, or spend some time with someone and begin to like him or her, would, I think, fall into this infatuation category. After time has passed and we have gotten to know the person better – usually when we begin to see ‘negative’ aspects about the person – and we still remain affectionate towards him or her, can we realise that it may be more than ‘a crush’. Perhaps we can now say we ‘love’ this person, as it was described in the link. Admitting to love someone is part of being a healthy adult, right?

Okay. If we accept that, what would constitute to a ‘more-than-friend’ relationship? Is it just the physical attraction? Or is there another – perhaps ethereal and incorporeal – ‘thing’ that binds two people into the love needed in a stable and long-lasting relationship? Or is it just a mutual decision by the two that they wish to commit themselves and remain with each other exclusively? And what would we think about polygamy (having more than one spouse) here? Is it possible to really ‘love’ (as in, the love you would imagine exists between a happy couple) more than one person simultaneously?

And back to the idea of conditional love. Is it really possible to accept someone completely and be able to forgive them of any mistakes? For example; if one of the couple committed adultery, is it really reasonable to hold that their aficionado (lover – new word for the day :P) could just forgive them? I suppose it could be argued that by committing adultery in the first place, the couple were never truly in love to begin with. I would probably tend to agree with this idea, unless the situation was more complicated and involved the use of alcohol or some other mind-altering drug.

So that’s probably long enough for today. Basically, the points to consider if you want to discuss: Is it possible to love more than one person? What does ‘love’ between a healthy and committed couple comprise of in order to amalgamate (unite – sorry, I like using jargon/technical language and long words :P) them? Is unconditional love really possible in a relationship – between two aficionados or compadres (friends), regardless? Feel free to use examples of experience, because I have none in this field, so I’m only reasoning out my answers from what I’ve seen throughout my life ^_^;

  • satoshii

    Well, to be honest, the person who wrote that has a point, but its all wrong to just catorgorise it. Love affects people in different ways, and they feel different things.

    Well, conditional love. It seems to happen to anyone who has fallen in love, and people feel their aficionados (hehe) are perfect, intil such time as they’ve known them long enough, lost interest, or have actually managed to make a relationship with them.

    My views on ‘crushes’. Well, people who are in love dont like to admit it, but i think at first people are in crush mode. Only exceptions are those who don’t take the bait of the other person until an anagnarsis (a time where something suddenly dawns on a person almost instantainiously). A crush is like the ‘first stage’, and can be taken further when your feelings are stronger..

  • satoshii

    Well, to be honest, the person who wrote that has a point, but its all wrong to just catorgorise it. Love affects people in different ways, and they feel different things.

    Well, conditional love. It seems to happen to anyone who has fallen in love, and people feel their aficionados (hehe) are perfect, intil such time as they’ve known them long enough, lost interest, or have actually managed to make a relationship with them.

    My views on ‘crushes’. Well, people who are in love dont like to admit it, but i think at first people are in crush mode. Only exceptions are those who don’t take the bait of the other person until an anagnarsis (a time where something suddenly dawns on a person almost instantainiously). A crush is like the ‘first stage’, and can be taken further when your feelings are stronger..

  • tremor16

    Anagnarsis? Douglas Adams perhaps? :P

  • tremor16

    Anagnarsis? Douglas Adams perhaps? :P

  • docdaneeka

    I always wonder why there is a link between love and exclusivity. Why only one person?

  • docdaneeka

    I always wonder why there is a link between love and exclusivity. Why only one person?

  • tremor16

    Anagnorisis – the sudden dawing of truth on a character in a play – a literary term, which explains why my dictionary didn’t have it :P

  • tremor16

    Anagnorisis – the sudden dawing of truth on a character in a play – a literary term, which explains why my dictionary didn’t have it :P

  • tremor16

    I imagine the 4 forms of love, used by the Greeks among other people may help to explain this.

    Agape – ‘selfless love’ – like the love a Christian would give to his or her neighbour
    Philia – ‘friendship’ – between two friends (obviously)
    Storge – ‘familial love’ – the love of a mother/father for the child and vice versa
    Eros – ‘erotic love’ – something I’ve got mixed feelings on. This is supposedly the type of love between a couple, but I cannot honestly believe that is is physical attraction alone. I’m prone to think it must be a combination between philia and eros. Then again, I prefer to think of a relationship between a couple as an advancement of a friendship rather than something separate in its own right.

  • tremor16

    I imagine the 4 forms of love, used by the Greeks among other people may help to explain this.

    Agape – ‘selfless love’ – like the love a Christian would give to his or her neighbour
    Philia – ‘friendship’ – between two friends (obviously)
    Storge – ‘familial love’ – the love of a mother/father for the child and vice versa
    Eros – ‘erotic love’ – something I’ve got mixed feelings on. This is supposedly the type of love between a couple, but I cannot honestly believe that is is physical attraction alone. I’m prone to think it must be a combination between philia and eros. Then again, I prefer to think of a relationship between a couple as an advancement of a friendship rather than something separate in its own right.

  • hevabee

    I think it is possible for somebody to love more than one person. For example, lets say a man’s wife dies and he eventually remarries. I’m sure he would argue that he loved/loves both women. But at the same time, as in polygamy, I’m not sure. There could be jealousy and dislike towards the other wives. And how can somebody truly love you if they are also “in love” with somebody else?

    For a “healthy and committed couple” to be able to unite happily, I agree that you will need more than just physical attraction. My friend once went out with a guy, who was so good looking, he could have been a model/movie star. But their relationship lasted not even a month, simply because she said he had no personality. That just demonstrates that looks are not everything. But then, they are worth something. I don’t know if this is just me being shallow, but there has to be some physical attraction between two people if they are going to have a serious relationship. Although, I think personality is the deciding factor.

    Unconditional love. Now thats a tough one. May have to get back to you on that.

  • hevabee

    I think it is possible for somebody to love more than one person. For example, lets say a man’s wife dies and he eventually remarries. I’m sure he would argue that he loved/loves both women. But at the same time, as in polygamy, I’m not sure. There could be jealousy and dislike towards the other wives. And how can somebody truly love you if they are also “in love” with somebody else?

    For a “healthy and committed couple” to be able to unite happily, I agree that you will need more than just physical attraction. My friend once went out with a guy, who was so good looking, he could have been a model/movie star. But their relationship lasted not even a month, simply because she said he had no personality. That just demonstrates that looks are not everything. But then, they are worth something. I don’t know if this is just me being shallow, but there has to be some physical attraction between two people if they are going to have a serious relationship. Although, I think personality is the deciding factor.

    Unconditional love. Now thats a tough one. May have to get back to you on that.

  • tremor16

    *Nods. But what of more-than-friend relationships? Surely two friends would have the personality factor. But do you think it is only physical/intimacy that extends this to a bf-gf relationship, or something else we cannot describe, or perhaps just a concious decision to be together?

  • tremor16

    *Nods. But what of more-than-friend relationships? Surely two friends would have the personality factor. But do you think it is only physical/intimacy that extends this to a bf-gf relationship, or something else we cannot describe, or perhaps just a concious decision to be together?

  • hevabee

    I think you need to be physically attracted to a person as well as attracted to their personality. I know I could not have a relationship with someone who I did not find at all physically attractive. I mean, please tell me if this is shallow, but could you?

    Something else that we cannot describe? If that is the case, I think I’d need experience before I could commment on that.

  • hevabee

    I think you need to be physically attracted to a person as well as attracted to their personality. I know I could not have a relationship with someone who I did not find at all physically attractive. I mean, please tell me if this is shallow, but could you?

    Something else that we cannot describe? If that is the case, I think I’d need experience before I could commment on that.

  • tremor16

    I don’t think it’s shallow or unreasonable to want physical attraction. I mean, you are going to spend the rest of your life with this person aren’t you? Surely you should be able to look at them and ‘enjoy’ what you see (for lack of a better word :P). I think having too high standards about physical aspects is dangerous though. I generally have very high standards about connections, but then again I prefer to wait until I feel something geniune than lie just to make the person happy, as much as it will hurt them. Physical though; as long as I fidn them attractive, I’m happy. I tend not to rate peopel against ideals, rather, what i see in them.

  • tremor16

    I don’t think it’s shallow or unreasonable to want physical attraction. I mean, you are going to spend the rest of your life with this person aren’t you? Surely you should be able to look at them and ‘enjoy’ what you see (for lack of a better word :P). I think having too high standards about physical aspects is dangerous though. I generally have very high standards about connections, but then again I prefer to wait until I feel something geniune than lie just to make the person happy, as much as it will hurt them. Physical though; as long as I fidn them attractive, I’m happy. I tend not to rate peopel against ideals, rather, what i see in them.